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Pirate ship changes for Dominion

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 8 post(s)
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.12 13:07:00 - [1] Edited by: Gypsio III on 12/09/2009 13:11:04 Originally by: Turiel Demon Ok, i've had a bit more of a think and I think I've worked out my problem with them. Lets look at the BS: they're going to be really really good at killing under-sized targets - Bhaalgorn with 20km neuts AND 20km webs - vindi with 90% web AND super tracking - gila with plenty of drone space for smalls+mediums AND 50% extra damage to them. These pirate BS will be solo-pwnmobiles, not reliant on support, and CCP has always shied away from that. What gives? Well, you could say the same thing about the Domi - that has no problem killing a lot of small stuff. Although these BS are certainly powerful, they're still BS, with BS mobility (Machariel though?). They don't have the ease of dictation of engagement that old-style nano had, and will be tackled and killed.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.12 13:31:00 - [2] Are you blind? The Navy Domi is incredible. That extra midslot is extraordinarily powerful. It can do everything - max gank shield buffer tank with neutrons, armour tank with triple OTL or tracking disruptors, remote rep, project good DPS to good range, etc. The rust on Minnie ships comes from the tears of Typhoon pilots upon seeing this ship and its "versatility".
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.12 13:37:00 - [3] If the Machariel supposed to be the most mobile BS, it would really make much more sense with a shield tank, so 6-6 meds-lows rather than 5-7.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.12 14:35:00 - [4] Edited by: Gypsio III on 12/09/2009 14:36:33 Originally by: wallenbergaren I want it to be a better drone boat, as in, more powerful specifically when it comes to deploying drones. Well, I don't. I want to it to be a flexible, unpredictable BS with more med- and lowslots than any other (probably) BS. I want it to be good at everything, rather than just drones.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.13 13:14:00 - [5] Bloody hell this thread is full of idiots. Liang, you have much more patience than I have.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.13 18:11:00 - [6] CCP, can you please fix the CPU requirements of shield transporters so we don't end up armour tanking our shield-resist-bonused faction BS?
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.14 17:09:00 - [7] Originally by: Lili Lu Originally by: Lord Eremet If those joke guristas changes goes through I will sell my rattler. Someone at ccp love droneboats thats for sure, but its not a main Caldari weapon, and shield resist bonus just screams OP. I fail to see why the gallente should have 3 droneboats when they could just shieldtank the new navy dominix with its six meds, if thats what they wish. These changes will give gallente 2 lines of pirate ships perfect for them and missile users will have none. I could ofc accept a compromise. Remove the useless railgun bonus and give the gallente drone bonus to it but no increase in dronebay. You either use 3 heavy drones that can be killed or a mix of medium/light drones to kill tacklers. My point is drones should just remain a complement, and not become its primary weapon system. Are guristas Caldari with some Gallente influences or is it a gallente line with some caldari influences? Or just scrap this **** and go back to the drawing board, CCP. Precisely. Serps are the mainly Gallente pirate faction, Guristas are the mainly Caldari pirate faction. The new Gurista ships are more Gallante than Gallente, with a shield tank and missile ship welded on top. Stupid and makes no sense with the backstory. Glad to see people with a primarilly Caldari focus arriving at the same conclusion many Gallente focused pilots have. Don't be thick, both of you. Serpentis = Gallente and Minmatar Guristas = Gallente and Caldari That's a mix of both, not mainly one or the other. Just because the old Rattler had no Gallente influence at all, you think that just getting some drones makes it "more Gallente than Gallente". If anything, the Caldari influence is still too strong in Guristas, what with the shield tank and missiles both coming from Caldari.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.14 18:06:00 - [8] It makes no sense to give a primary-magnet such as a shield-tanking faction BS an ECM bonus.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.15 20:12:00 - [9] Originally by: Xahara Originally by: Ghwerig Dear Dev (Devs), or some other mentally handicapped person that CCP has granted the job of changing Gueristas ships. IÆd like to say that you ****ed up the job and should return the money that you got for it. In case you donÆt know, the dominating race in this faction is not Gallente, but Caldari. These pirates act based on modified doctrines of the Caldari Fleet. Gallente is an add-on, bonus. I will agree that, until now, the bonus for Gallente skills was marginal. However, what you want to do is throw into the game another Dominix with a different hull (By the way, compare the sizes of both ships and ask yourself how something as small as a Rattlesnake can have a drone bay larger than a Dominix). The idea of making the Gallente bonus sensible is OK, but the way you are trying to accomplish thisà If you want to make this ship better, one simple change is enough-revoke the bonus to hybrids and add what you are proposing to drones. DonÆt touch the drone bay, donÆt touch the bandwidth. You donÆt have to add any slots. Take away the turrets and excess slots, but keep your dirty hands off the rocket weaponry of this ship, the slots and bonuses. If you still insist on castrating the weapons, do it like your smarter friends and, in exchange for the loss of two launcher hardpoints and the RoF bonus, give a 100% damage bonus to the four left over launcher hardpoints. I don't understand why people are still whining about the Rattlesnake. Are you all blind and don't realize the giant buffer you can put on this ship? It's not a damn dominix. It's an overpowered dominix! And I don't see anything wrong with that... On another note, the Vindicator needs moar damage bonus. Pls :D This expansion is gonna rock. Props to CCP :) Mission-runners don't care about buffer.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.19 14:31:00 - [10] Originally by: Bellum Eternus Stuff like fully passive Rattlesnakes are some of the only ships in all of Eve that can stand up to it. Do you mean "buffer" or "passive with SPRs etc"?

Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.19 19:58:00 - [11] Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: Gypsio III Originally by: Bellum Eternus Stuff like fully passive Rattlesnakes are some of the only ships in all of Eve that can stand up to it. Do you mean "buffer" or "passive with SPRs etc"? This particular one was fit with a buffer tank, but the REALLY amusing thing is that even though the tank wasn't set up for peak regen, it still had so much regen that I was only able to break it after fitting THREE heatsinks to the Bhaal, plus it's full complement of Ogre IIs. Anything less and I wasn't able to break the peak regen. Additionally- with 3x HS2 fit to the Bhaalgorn it's tank was crap and even though I was able to break the regen of the Rattlesnake it was a moot point as my tank caved in long before I was able to finish off the Rattlesnake. Ok, thanks. To Sisi!
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.20 10:48:00 - [12] Originally by: Cpt Hook You oviously know that a dominix with electrons can deal 844 DPS with t1 amo, right? stick some faction ammo in those guns, and you will actually outdamage a ship 20x more expensive You oviously know that when it come to a torpedo ship the actuall dps is actually much smaller when you shoot targets smallerr then let's say, a carrier; and even so, if that carrier have 2 smartbombs fitted, your dps will go from 875 on PAPER to actually 0... But you actually know all of that, i'm sure... fake edit: i forgot the rollings , actually... You're pretty thick if you compare torps (range ~29 km) to Electrons (range negligible). You're pretty thick if you think that the Electrons don't also have tracking. You're pretty thick.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.22 17:11:00 - [13] It helps if you understand what the agility number means before you start ranting.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.22 19:38:00 - [14] The range bonus on the Gila is useful as well, because it allows you to use HAMs out to ~28 km. But it's not that useful on the Worm, as the extra range of LMs isn't that useful (although the extra speed is useful for hitting fast stuff), the difficulty of actually fitting SMLs, the extra range isn't that useful for rockets, and, well, roflkets.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.23 11:12:00 - [15] Hardly. The proposed Rattler is no better than a Domi at AFK-missioning, and the old Rattler is no better than a Raven at missioning, AFK or otherwise.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.24 00:58:00 - [16] Originally by: Ulstan The Gila I think doesn't get all that much out of it either. It doesn't really help heavy missiles. You can get huge ranges with standard heavy missiles. With maxxed skills, I think HAM's can hit out to 20km without a velocity bonus, which I think is just about as far as you'd need for a close range weapon. It's not quite 24km but it's pretty close. The velocity bonus is perfect for the Gila. The Gila doesn't want to be right up in the faces of its victims, it wants to be hovering outside web range so it can take advantage of its range-independent DPS, avoid enemy fire and retain the ability to disengage. It may not do much for HMs, but the increase in HAM range is perfect for this, as it takes it from ~18 km, which would preclude the use of HAMs in this fashion, to ~28 km - overheated T2 disruptor range. That 10 km of range is of immense tactical importance. But, as noted, this doesn't work for the Worm. Extra velocity on light missiles is similar to extra range on the Gila's HMs - not useless, but not exactly great either. But the Gila-HAM trick doesn't work on the Worm. It only gives it ~5 km more range, to 15 km or so. But this 5 km range is worth much less and is much harder to maintain because of the greater mobility of frigates and the existence of webs and scramblers in the same region of range. Even if rockets were fixed, it still wouldn't be a useful bonus. The velocity bonus is also fine on the Rattler, because, as with the Gila, that 10 km more range is tactically useful. Even though the Rattler isn't going to be dancing around the edge of web range, the ability to send torps 10 km further, from ~18 km to the edge of overheated disruptor range, is useful and powerful.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.09.24 08:36:00 - [17] Originally by: Stealthbug yes it's nice, but with only 4 hardpoints it's going to have the damage equal to that of a lemon slice... HEY LOOK AT ME! I'm going to defeat you with my Fruit Catapult Tank! RAWR It can do 950 DPS to ~28 km.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.10.07 13:46:00 - [18] You don't need a Navy Scorp. A bog-standard Raven is basically the same as the current TQ Rattlesnake.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.10.08 10:28:00 - [19] Originally by: Emperor Khain If you don't believe me, check on EFT, set skills etc up to the same and try get a raven to get the same DPS and tank as a RS. Just done it, it's easy. Whatever people's opinions on the proposed Rattler changes, the sad fact is that the current TQ Rattlesnake is basically just a Raven with an extra lowslot and some more EHP.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.10.08 13:44:00 - [20] Edited by: Gypsio III on 08/10/2009 13:45:46 Originally by: Emperor Khain Ok I shoulda been more specific, get 6 T2 siege launchers with rage torps to go 50 km+ on a raven while still getting a decent tank and DPS, if you can go that, please god gimme that fit! Getting Rage torps to 50 km is impossible on Raven or Rattlesnake. But you wouldn't want to use Rage anyway. So let's assume that you meant Jav... [Raven, torp pve] Damage Control II Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Caldari Navy Large Shield Booster Ballistic Deflection Field II Ballistic Deflection Field II Heat Dissipation Field II Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron Siege Missile Launcher II, Juggernaut Javelin Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Juggernaut Javelin Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Juggernaut Javelin Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Juggernaut Javelin Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Juggernaut Javelin Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Juggernaut Javelin Torpedo [empty high slot] [empty high slot] Large Hydraulic Bay Thrusters I Large Hydraulic Bay Thrusters I Large Rocket Fuel Cache Partition I 65 km Jav torp range, 511 DPS vs. 3:1 Guristas damage profile. The current TQ Rattlesnake and Raven have the same CPU and PG. So the only difference really is the extra lowslot - but that isn't really useful once you have four BCS on, which a Raven can do with some minor pimping. Now, you might argue that that "minor pimping" voids the comparison, but the cost of those mods on the above Raven is considerably less than that of a Rattlesnake.

Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.10.08 14:34:00 - [21] Well, the DC II adds plenty to the shield tank - for the 3:1 Guristas profile, it takes it from 477 DPS to 511 DPS. You could use a PDS instead though, for extra cap, but the cap-stable tank with a PDS is only 12 better than that with a DC II (177 vs. 189 DPS), so my gut feeling is for the DC II. It's probably worth admitting at this point that not only have I never tried that fit, but also that I haven't run a L4 mission in over two years - and even then I only ran a handful. So I don't know whether that's enough tank and cap. But it seems comparable to the tanks that other other gank-heavy L4 BS that I've seen posted have, especially since those BS rats won't last long with ~900 DPS on them, so it seems reasonable enough to me.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.10.12 17:12:00 - [22] Originally by: Ulstan It sounds like you're seriously trying to dumb down the game, here. Sounds more like "Wah, wah, boost me, nerf you" tbh.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.10.14 18:22:00 - [23] Originally by: A Ingus he is correct about the Gila. It is way over the top. I can fly the thing, just don't think it's right or good for the game, balance wise. Ridiculous passive tanks and bonused larger than BS dronebays on a cruiser at 100mil? If that's all the Gila will cost why train into tech II cruisers for an Ishtar? Neither ship are insurable. The Ishtar is essentially made obsolete. See someone in a Ishtar and laugh, what a fool. Hell with one of these forget about training BC and BS at all. Drake, Raven, Domi, who need em. Get an alt with Gallente and Caldari cruiser 4, drone, missile, and shield skills and go to the bank on level 4s. Nobody cares about these things' performances in PVE. Nobody cares about the "backstory". Nobody passive-tanks in PVP.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.11.16 16:20:00 - [24] Originally by: Killmeded Im new - but I like missiles - I have been look for a decent faction missile frig -- these upgrades are INSANE -- 2 KILLER new missile frigs and a cruiser - worm - gila - and hookbill navy -- Im gonna sell me a plex just to buy a worm and gila b4 the patch comes and I cant get one - I can LP the hookbill Good luck trying to fit any modules to the Hookbill with its lol CPU. After MWD, SMLs and a Disruptor II you can't actually fit, well, almost anything.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.12.01 14:49:00 - [25] Originally by: seiryuudragon Rattlesnake: waaaa waaaa waaaa Contract it to me. You can replace your billion-ISK Rattlesnake with a 100 million-ISK Raven. They both have six bonused launchers, the same DPS and the same tank.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.12.01 15:00:00 - [26] The old-style Rattlesnake was no better than a Raven. You were stupid to spend a billion ISK on it. Now it's been boosted and all you can do is whine?
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.12.01 16:49:00 - [27] Edited by: Gypsio III on 01/12/2009 16:48:54 Originally by: seiryuudragon the rattlesnake has one more low slot on it to where you can fit an extra flux coil Flux coils. lol. Come on, be serious...

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